New SEO/Design Client - Link Exchange

[HHI Golf Guy]

I have just completed a web site design for a new client, and now I am beginning to work on the off-page SEO. If you would like to exchange links find the "add url" link at the bottom of each page.

For those of you hooked on PR, the index page is currently a PR3. The sub pages have no PR - they are all new pages to the web site.

Don't get too hung up on PR, though. The way that our agent link pages are designed as State information and agent pages your own web site will benefit from the page/site relevance.

You may also want to take a look at the link/text strategy that we are using for this site. You may want to employ the same strategy for your descriptive text and anchor text.

You can get to the site by following this Hilton Head real estate (http://www.felicelamarca.com) link.

[kyle422]

I was checking out your link exchange policy for this site and saw this, "The page where you are placing our link has been properly indexed by the MSN, Yahoo, and Google search engines." The page that my link would be located on your clients site is not cached by Google. Also, you are requiring 3 links to your clients site for one link back (you only have one text box for "link,anchor text"). Doesn't make too much sense to me. I was going to exchange with the site because I'm sure that the links pages would be indexed soon, but I don't give multiple links to sites when doing link exchanges.

[HHI Golf Guy]

I was checking out your link exchange policy for this site and saw this, "The page where you are placing our link has been properly indexed by the MSN, Yahoo, and Google search engines." The page that my link would be located on your clients site is not cached by Google. Also, you are requiring 3 links to your clients site for one link back (you only have one text box for "link,anchor text"). Doesn't make too much sense to me. I was going to exchange with the site because I'm sure that the links pages would be indexed soon, but I don't give multiple links to sites when doing link exchanges.

We just loaded these pages two days ago, so not all the pages are indexed. Usually, I do not even post a link exchange request until all of the pages are indexed, but I jumped the gun this time. We deleted her previous 20 page site and created a core site with over 200 content driven, static pages. More will follow over the next year. I do understand if someone follows the same policy that I do regarded indexed pages.

As far as the 3-1 link, there is no where in anything that I have stated that says you cannot employ the same strategy that I am using for links. In fact, take a look at the quote in my first post:

You may also want to take a look at the link/text strategy that we are using for this site. You may want to employ the same strategy for your descriptive text and anchor text.

If you choose to employ the same method, then just put your info in the "Site Description" box - that's what I always do.

Whether you choose to exchange links with any of my client sites is up to you.

[kyle422]

Understood. I think that most people would agree that a three link/anchor text exchange is not a very good way to obtain linking partners. You are correct about it being my choice to exchange links, which is an obvious conclusion, but I was giving some constructive criticism. :rolleyes:

[HHI Golf Guy]

This is but one of the many linking techniques that we use for our clients, and it works quite well.

I don't understand why you are hung up on the so called 3 for 1. In fact, of the tens of thousands of links that we have brokered over the years this is the first hint of a "complaint" that I have heard.

Setting up links this way does not only benefit my clients - in the future it will also benefit the site owners that place the links and site owners that employ these strategies.

As link trading becomes more sophisticated and site owners try to overpower the SERP's with tens of thousands of links search engines such as Google, MSN, and Yahoo will have no choice but to alter the way that they interpret site popularity based upon links. Within the next 12-24 months I predict that standard link pages will be devalued. Sites that use standard linking methods - even sites with tens of thousands of links - will see significant drops in the SERP's. We are already seeing the early signs of link relevance.

The best way to combat these inevitable changes is to make your links pages a series of small stories or paragraphs. These paragraphs should all fit a common theme that ties to the title of the page (i.e. South Carolina real estate) so that the entire page ties together. This will give credibility to both the page as a reliable source on your own site as well as lend credibility to the outbound links from your site.

Beginning in early 2006 we will be undertaking a project and contacting all of our link partners and asking them to switch their link on our site to this format, as well as replace our link if they have our old format.

To do well in SEO you need to know not only what makes a site rank well today, but also use common sense to anticipate where the SE's will need to go in the future to prevent search engine spam. This way, when a major algo change like the infamous Florida update takes place our clients should see little or no negative repercussions.

[gemini]

Interesting thoughts, indeed. I'm not sure if that will differ from the links with descriptions that people use nowdays, since link value is being lowered in general. I know MSN scientists were working on very interesting content clastering and analises - there are some works available in pdf that I can't find right now, but do you have any official sources you could give us links to that make you think that technique mentioned above is the way to go?

[HHI Golf Guy]

but do you have any official sources you could give us links to that make you think that technique mentioned above is the way to go?

What do you mean by official? From G, Y, or MSN?

I do my own thing when it comes to SEO and it is all based on common sense and not trying (or claiming) to crack an algo. Perhaps a better way to look at it is, "If I had my own search engine, how would I combat spammers destroying my results and lowering the credibility of my search engine?"

Sites rank well for two major reasons:

1. What is on the pages (HTML and content)
2. The links that point to the site

In the old days you could spam your way to the top of a search engine with keyword stuffing and hidden text. The major search engines have all but put a stop to that.

Now you help spam your way to the top of the SE's with link bombing. Granted, MSN and Y don't have the same link emphasis as G, but it is still present in their algo. Since the major SE's want to protect the integrity of their results, the next logical step is for the SE's to combat link spam.

Of course, link spam doesn't work for everyone. I read a lot about people with 20k links and they can't make a dent in the SERP's. Quality counts.

Now let's get back to the way that I want to handle reciprocal links on my pages. First off, I categorize my real estate link exchanges by state and then add content relevant to that state (although I should probably also add a solid paragraph of text).

Now, if I can get my exchange partners to submit "mini-stories" with 2 or 3 links and I add a few appropriate headings on the page it will lend credibility to that page. My thinking is that this will also help my sites to become authority sites on the term "real estate". Truthfully, if this works as planned it will probably benefit my link partners more than it benefits my sites.

My plan is to restrict each page to 5 or 6 of these paragraphs and use multiple pages as needed. However, I probably will not use sub pages for the overflow (i.e. the secondary Alabama page can only be accessed by the primary Alabama page). Instead, I will list both pages on my main resources page. (BTW, it really ticks me off when people create one link page and then you have to drill down 50 pages to get to the bottom of the links. For link pages to be of any benefit to link partners they should be built in parallel and not in series).

In its most basic elements, search engines look for content and links. This link strategy addresses both of those items.

[gemini]

What do you mean by official? From G, Y, or MSN?

I thought you base your strategy on some facts. Yes, we're all gessing here, so that is fine too - I was just wandering if you have something more insightful :)

Now, if I can get my exchange partners to submit "mini-stories" with 2 or 3 links and I add a few appropriate headings on the page it will lend credibility to that page. My thinking is that this will also help my sites to become authority sites on the term "real estate". Truthfully, if this works as planned it will probably benefit my link partners more than it benefits my sites.

My plan is to restrict each page to 5 or 6 of these paragraphs and use multiple pages as needed. However, I probably will not use sub pages for the overflow (i.e. the secondary Alabama page can only be accessed by the primary Alabama page). Instead, I will list both pages on my main resources page. (BTW, it really ticks me off when people create one link page and then you have to drill down 50 pages to get to the bottom of the links. For link pages to be of any benefit to link partners they should be built in parallel and not in series).


I've been thinking about similar technique - I'm kinda sick of seeing all the same states, links and descriptions all over the real estate sites - it just looks so-o-o... seo/link exchange cliche.. basically if a realtor wants to have his relocation partners in different states - why won't he/she get a few reps per state - one per area and give them a whole page to have their content on it, so that would be a mini home page for each relocation partner - that could get at least a few hundred fully loaded, content rich extremly relevant pages that would benefit all of the partners at first hand. I'm saying a few paragraphs - at least 500 words for each real estate partner - this would also serve as good referral strategy. The only problem is writing this unique content for the partners - this is where the paid copywriters/content writers would be in great help :)

[HHI Golf Guy]

I thought you base your strategy on some facts. Yes, we're all gessing here, so that is fine too - I was just wandering if you have something more insightful :)

There can't be any hard facts yet - the SE's have not deployed the changes to their algos. It just makes sense that they will eventually have to stop link spam. Even if they don't change their algos, this strategy will still benefit inbound and outbound links. There is no risk on my end - or for my clients.

Our sites will still have some standard links, and I'll even use a few other link strategies.

a mini home page for each relocation partner

Do you think that too much "foreign content" with your strategy or mine - will end up diluting the overall theme of the site?

[gemini]

Do you think that too much "foreign content" with your strategy or mine - will end up diluting the overall theme of the site?

Have you had experience diluting the overall theme? I haven't so I wouldn't know for sure, but employing the same techniques back to your site (I mean incoming links with custom content pages from others) - shouldn't it justify? Well, if not, than it can be justified by thought trhough internal linking between those pages and your content... I guess.

This topic worth to discuss :) let's keep it alive.

[gemini]

I just came across the paperwork I mentioned ftp://ftp.research.microsoft.com/pub/tr/TR-2004-50.pdf

[frobn]

I just came across the paperwork I mentioned ftp://ftp.research.microsoft.com/pub/tr/TR-2004-50.pdfExcellent find. I only had time to browse but so far what I see coincides with what I have been observing not only with MSN but also with Google. I think it is a natural progression from link-centric to semantic-centric. Previously, I had used the term content-centric but logically it makes more sense for the SEs to measure the semantic meaning of the page content utilizing factors like the design structure and architecture of the content. The implication is that the hierarchy of the page is more important than previously thought. It may be good to bush up on meta and heading tags as well as anchor text. Links will continue to be important but only when the link and target are congruent.

[HHI Golf Guy]

Have you had experience diluting the overall theme?

Absolutely. One of our real estate sites had over 40% of its pages and content devoted to golf. The site was top #1 for its primary KW and Yahoo, MSN, and most of the others - except Google. The site had more (quality) backlinks than all but 2 sites in G's top 10, and was #2 for allinanchor for the main phrase. But in the SERP's it bounced between 100 and 300 for that phrase as and between 70 and 200 for other competitive phrases.

I moved all of the golf info to a sub-domain. I also submitted to Google the pages that were removed from the root directory. By the time Google re-spidered and indexed the site it jumped to #4 in the SERP's for that phrase.

During the period where the SERP's jumped we made no other changes to the site. We did not even add a single link.

Is the data empirical? Not a chance. But the timing of the rise in SERP's and when G had re-indexed the site had me convinced enough that themes did play a role in G.

[gemini]

Interesting, that's why I was thinking about the internal linking to be a factor instead of moveing things to third level domain, or actually moving it to the TLD and linking the same way as we're doing right now - from every page.

[kthor]

would be willing to exchange with your site with my www.theforeclosuresinfo.com site..but it will have to be with 3 anchor txt too to make for an even trade..let me know if interested

[kthor]

Hi Golf,

got your site here :

http://www.theforeclosuresinfo.com/real-estate-directory/south-carolina.shtml

let me know when you've place my link

[HHI Golf Guy]

I will be working on links next Tuesday. If you do not get an email or PM from me on Tuesday please feel free to send me a nasty email. :)

My in laws are in town right now and my mind is sludge - I may forget.

[kthor]

My in laws are in town right now and my mind is sludge - I may forget.[/QUOTE]

:p LOL

if I don't get any pm's or mail, I know you are out of the house renting a place..lol

[llaflamme]

HHi Golf Guy,
Nice web site, Hilton Head.
Great pictures and the display is good.
I also work for ERA.
Lori L.

[HHI Golf Guy]

My in laws are in town right now and my mind is sludge - I may forget.

:p LOL

if I don't get any pm's or mail, I know you are out of the house renting a place..lol[/QUOTE]

Sorry I did not get back to you. My wife was hospitalized this week and I am trying to catch up on my daily workload. I hope to get back to linking by next week.

P.S. The baby is fine and my wife is now home resting comfortably. We hope to be back to our normal routines by next week.

[HHI Golf Guy]

HHi Golf Guy,
Nice web site, Hilton Head.
Great pictures and the display is good.
I also work for ERA.
Lori L.

Thanks. Which site were you looking at? Felice's?

Next week - pending approval by Travelocity - we should be opening a new regional travel web site for one of our clients. Graphics wise the site is OK, I mean it's a heck of a lot better than 99% of most travel web sites but it lacks the pop of some of our CSS designs. We will have some nice Flash video on parts of the site to spice it up.

The back end of the application is pretty neat with an XML interface to tie in to the Travelocity database. We couldn't use the CSS layering and positioning techniques on the site because of the way we have to handle XML feeds, but it's still a good looking site (IMHO).

The best news is that if we can help them drive traffic and sales on this site our client wants us to design, SEO, and maintain another 130 web sites.

I'll post the URL when we open for business.

[happy home]

If you are interested in link exchange visit our site